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Post by Eyalan on Aug 1, 2006 7:15:52 GMT -5
What I don't really understand is there is said that the elves will fade with time (very long time of course) and that the elves' race will disappear completely. But what about their children/grand children etc. Can't they have children of their own anymore? And since elves are immortal, wouldnt it be logical that there will be more and more of them?
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Post by Vincent Valentine on Aug 8, 2006 13:23:26 GMT -5
What they mean by fading of the elves is either the fading of the elves from Middle-Earth or if the men took morgoth's side in the last battle
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Post by Anwyn on Sept 7, 2006 0:13:08 GMT -5
Elves are not born in the traditional sense, its more of a fact that they are reborn into different bodies. Tolkien never shared names of elves, it has caused a great deal of confusion over the years with there being two Glorfindels. When an Elf dies, which does happen, There spirit or fëa is sent to Mandos to await new birth. Though before this would happen they would have to be judged and deemed worthy to be reborn again. That part reminds me in a way of Egyptian Mythologhy and the weighing of the heart against the feather of truth. Another theory, and I am completely just throwing this out there. That perhaps since the Elves are so closely tied to the natural world, the earth and plants that even though trees may grow for hundreds upon hundreds of years, that there will come a time where it will begin to fade and die, and perhaps something similar happened with the elves, they had reached the autumn of there excistance in Middle Earth and they passed, For they were the Firstborn and came many many many years before the awakening of men. Just another crazy theory of mine, I am really tired so most likely none of that made any sense
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Post by Vincent Valentine on Sept 7, 2006 1:35:01 GMT -5
Well when the elves' "body" dies the spirit does go to mandos that is true but the elves are reborn but they can never return to middle-earth....i might be mistaken.
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Post by Miluiel Greenleaf on Sept 18, 2006 12:52:04 GMT -5
That part reminds me in a way of Egyptian Mythologhy and the weighing of the heart against the feather of truth. Hmm got point! I'm somewhat an expert on Egyptian history (don't ask me to recite any dates, but I've been studying it for about...five years.) Anyway, that's very true what you say. Only I doubt there was a horrible crocodile-headed monster awaiting them should their heart not be light enough.
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Post by Tar-Amon on Sept 19, 2006 10:28:33 GMT -5
Glorfindel returned from Aman, - Tolkien spent the last years of his life stating in letters that Glorfindel of Gondolin was he same as Glorfindel of Rivendell, he was sent back to help with the assualts of Sauron in Eriador. Yes, Elves are reborn, but it seems to me it was the Valar initially who wished them to be taken to Aman, a selfish reason, since they looked on them and loved them. And it was known that Mortal Men would increase far more quickly and gradually force Elves from their own kingdoms by sheer weight of numbers. The Elves Days of Glory were actually in Aman before the Oath of Feanor, not in Middle Earth. I did recently read, but forgot to save the page, that the Elves, being reborn, do not actually increase their numbers, one body dies, the fea goes into another, so one dies, and one is born, as it were .
And Tolkien says, of Dagor Dagorath the Last Battle, that if Men fight with the Valar and Elves against Melkor , then Elves will continue to live in the World, if Man sides with Melkor, then the Elves will fade from the Earth completely and only ever be in Aman. More information on his thoughts on the Elves and their fading, is found in his History of Middle Earth, series, that's basically all the notes he ever complied and his ideas and jottings. But Elves will always live in Aman , beyond the world, they won't cease to be completely.
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